R22: hurt ego

1st Official Post

    Finally had the time to give the R22 a proper try. Being an experienced simmer I obviously turned on the Pro mode immediately. 8) No simple basic controls for me, no sir!

    My goodness.... this R22 really is something different!!! What a handful! I am flying back and forth and left and right all over the place!!! That thing is almost uncontrollable! I can't even get NEAR the landing spot: I am going back or left or right but never where I want to go...!

    Okay... this is something different indeed. Maybe it's a good idea to turn of the Pro mode and try the basic mode. X/ Back to the selection screen it is.

    Er... :huh: I really thought I ticked that Pro option... =O No... so... THIS WAS THE EASY MODE????!!! That can't be true! Let's give it another try... Pro mode still ticked? Yes. Okay, here we go...

    8| ;( I SUCK AT THIS! So my first flight was in the basic mode already indeed...! Pro mode is even more killing (in all possible ways)!!!

    In short: the R22 really hurt my ego. 8o There is a lot to learn yet...! ;) This R22 really seems to be simulated pretty realistic... :thumbup:

    It takes several hours to learn to coordinate the basics of hovering a real helicopter. In that scenario you have better reference due to peripheral vision and better feedback of what’s happening in the seat of your pants.

    It takes lots of practice to do it in a sim but it’s a nice achievement when you can put it exactly where you want it and you know you are in full control.

    Well, I spend some more time with the R22 but I just can't control it. I read the tutorial that was posted elsewhere and it said you have to learn how to hover first. So far I haven't been able to hover at all. As soon as I lose contact with the ground I usually fly backwards. I also have to very precisely control my rudder pedals to avoid turning around but it's almost impossible because the hot spot to prevent turning (in either direction) is extremely small. Just a slight touch of my feet and I spin already. Needless to say it's completely impossible to get into a hover once I started moving. I am beginning to wonder if my hardware is up to it: I know you have to spend hours with this heli before you can control it but what if my hardware is preventing me from learning it ever? (Saitek Combat Rudder pedals and Logitech Extreme 3D Pro.) I seriously wonder why everybody else seems to be flying around happily LOL!

    Quote from frui

    Have you mapped all your axis correctly? I have experienced similar fruistration in easy mode until I found that I have reversed the x axis, and then it's super easy.

    Everything is setup corretly, yes. I am talking about the Pro mode now though: I don't feel like learning to fly this one in easy mode and then having to start all over again in Pro mode. ;)

    Quote from J van E

    Well, I spend some more time with the R22 but I just can't control it. I read the tutorial that was posted elsewhere and it said you have to learn how to hover first. So far I haven't been able to hover at all. As soon as I lose contact with the ground I usually fly backwards. I also have to very precisely control my rudder pedals to avoid turning around but it's almost impossible because the hot spot to prevent turning (in either direction) is extremely small. Just a slight touch of my feet and I spin already. Needless to say it's completely impossible to get into a hover once I started moving. I am beginning to wonder if my hardware is up to it: I know you have to spend hours with this heli before you can control it but what if my hardware is preventing me from learning it ever? (Saitek Combat Rudder pedals and Logitech Extreme 3D Pro.) I seriously wonder why everybody else seems to be flying around happily LOL!

    Everything is setup corretly, yes. I am talking about the Pro mode now though: I don't feel like learning to fly this one in easy mode and then having to start all over again in Pro mode. ;)

    Easy or Pro mode?

    See my post about helicopters for beginners, try to use rudder trim as it tames the wild behaviour.

    For hover practice use the H.U.D. for attitude assistance, it helps put you in charge. I like to practice hovering over airfield taxiways or along roads. Make tiny attitude adjustments and only for as long as it takes to get the desired change.

    (Profi mode assumed, I see you used profi, perhaps you could try trimming the cyclic/joystick forward if you keep sweeping backwards. Note Jan didn't like me advocating trim).

    Edited once, last by Overloaded: My earlier post needed a change (December 2, 2018 at 4:18 PM).

    Quote from Jet-Pack

    Recalibrate your controls, the R22 usually doesn't fly backwards like that, at least not that quickly.

    Increase your deadzone maybe

    Did all that, The heli still starts moving as soon as I leave the ground. With a lot of effort I can prevent the spinning (using rudder pedals) but I can't prevent the moving (mainly backwards and to the right). It is impossible to maintain a steady hover (for now, at least). This is in Pro mode. I guess these are just beginners problems. Flying around is pretty easy as it is btw: it's mainly the take off and landing that is giving me problems. Although flying around is pretty hard work: I constantly have to apply 'rudder' and 'aileron' (I keep forgetting the correct helo terminology ;) ). I notice I also tend to lean to the left all the time (in real life) to somehow counteract what I am doing in the sim. Pretty complicated stuff.

    Could you maybe start a flight at 1500ft and then get used to moving it around without anything to hit nearby? It does sound like there might be an issue with your controls possibly - do you fly helicopters in any other sims? XP11 or DCS World?

    i5-12600K/MSI RTX 3080/Win11/64Gb RAM/Asus Xonar DX+ Beyer DT990 pro headphones/LG 34" UM65 @2560x1080/Quest Pro/TM Warthog+VKB MkIV Rudder pedals

    Have you turned wind off?

    Try the H.U.D. and enable joystick trim for trimming forward if the calibration does not help. It is hard to hold attitude with a big plain windscreen (with no dead flies).

    (It needs a lot of forward trim to tip forward when light on its skids but only a small amount to tip backwards)

    Edited once, last by Overloaded (December 2, 2018 at 5:22 PM).

    The Robbie in real life is quite twitchy. This definitely reflects that. Don't be surprised if you can't hover from the get go, I have only ever seen one guy hover a helicopter first time out, in over 25 years. I personally took around 3 hours of practice until I was remotely in charge. Keep at it, it will come. Once it does it is a very satisfying feeling.

    Edited once, last by CaptChaos (December 2, 2018 at 9:06 PM).

    This is, what I had quiet often in simulated flight. Oh, this is not flyable, that is absolutely not real.... Why can't people just try to learn? To learn from people doing the real thing? AFFS 2 do a lot of things in flight dynamics very good. You just have to try to get used to the real stuff and try to avoid compromises like using key strokes where real axis are necessary.Of cause, not everything is perfect in AF2. But a lot of simmers are not at the point to decide if it is the hardware, the sim or the own ability that lacks of realism. ;)

    Try to learn how to fly the real thing and you will see how outstanding the sim is.I have so many response from real aerobatic pilots, the flight dynamics of this sim is really close to reality. (Well, Walter Kampsmann thinks, the E330XL is a tiny bit underpowered in the sim, but beside of that like the real thing. :) )

    Try to believe and learn from the people flying the real planes and helis. Don't think if you have flown the R22 in a sim somewhere else it has to be the same. Don't be shy to ask how to fly. And don't be frustrated if it's not working the first time. This is one of the main points of a simulation: Be open to learn. :)

    Wish for Aerofly FS 2/4:

    - Flightpath recording on hard drive and replay in sim from different view points

    - Smoke for aerobatic planes

    - Multiplayer or at least watching other people flying sitting on ground or inside tower

    Edited once, last by flightxtreme (December 2, 2018 at 9:29 PM).

    Quote from CaptChaos

    Keep at it, it will come. Once it does it is a very satisfying feeling.

    O, I certainly will! Flight sims are at their best and most interesting when you have to learn something new! ;) I am getting the hang already of simply flying around, which is great: it gives a completely different feel to the sim. Someone said a few days ago that getting a heli in AFS2 is like getting a new sim and he was right! (To my surprise, yes!) Flying over Innsbruck with the heli is a totally different experience than flying over it with with a plane. Even in 2D things seem to look more real somehow...

    It will definitely take more than a few hours or days before I have this beast under control. (And I can understand how VR may help here but there are more reasons for me not using VR than just not liking it. ;) BTW Maybe the R22 is easier to fly in real life than in a sim somehow...? Because you don’t get any feedback in a sim?)

    Anyway, this R22 is a great addition to the fleet!

    As you practice you will think it is impossible for a while. Then after some time you will fire it up and you find you can hover. Thats how it happened for me in real life. After not being able to master it. We stopped for a coffee then went back out and bingo I could hover. OK it wasn't pretty but I was in control for the first time.

    Once you have it, and you will, the flexibility of flying a helicopter almost anywhere you want is a real thrill. ;):thumbup:

    Quote from CaptChaos

    As you practice you will think it is impossible for a while. Then after some time you will fire it up and you find you can hover. Thats how it happened for me in real life. After not being able to master it. We stopped for a coffee then went back out and bingo I could hover. OK it wasn't pretty but I was in control for the first time.

    Once you have it, and you will, the flexibility of flying a helicopter almost anywhere you want is a real thrill. ;):thumbup:

    i agree. It is a thrill. Just landed the R22 in front of the cathedral in Delft. No finer feeling!