How can I flatten the underground of a building?

  • Hi guys!


    I converted the church San Luca in Bologna/Italy to FS 2. I have known this church since the sixties from my visits to my grandparents in Bologna. The church has a special meaning for me.


    Unfortunately the underground of the church in FS 2 is not straight, so that the church either floats halfway or sinks. Can anyone explain to me how I can flatten the underground of the church so that I can put it properly on it?


    Thank you!

    Luca


    aerofly.com/community/index.php?attachment/18184/


    The conversion didn't work without errors. But that is another story. ;)

  • You can try a small flatten polygon of mesh according to the wiki tutorial for airports.

    You don't need to do it with 3DSMax, some people do it with AC3D or apparently even with Sketchup.


    What is important in the end of the day is

    - the surface material should be named according to the __airport__outside structure (see airport tutorial) => soft flattening

    - vertices must be painted black for the flatten to be transparent in AFS2


    Cheers

    Antoine

    Config : i7 6900K - 20MB currently set at 4.00GHz, Cooling Noctua NH-U14S, Motherboard ASUS Rampage V Extreme U3.1, RAM HyperX Savage Black Edition 16GB DDR4 3000 MHz, Graphic Card Gigabyte GeForce GTX 1080 8GB, Power supply Corsair RM Series 850W, Windows 10 64 bit.

  • You can try a small flatten polygon of mesh according to the wiki tutorial for airports.

    Some people do it with AC3D or apparently even with Sketchup.

    Assuming this is true about Sketchup. Not holding you to it because I know you use 3DSMax for your work.

    I've attempted this in Sketchup but was unsuccessful. This was awhile ago, and I easily just moved on to other things.

    If anybody knows how to do this in Sketchup, it would be greatly appreciated if you could share your workflow with the Aerofly Community.

    Flattening Ground Mesh is a HUGE desire for alot of user in this SIM.

  • Assuming this is true about Sketchup. Not holding you to it because I know you use 3DSMax for your work.

    I've attempted this in Sketchup but was unsuccessful. This was awhile ago, and I easily just moved on to other things.

    If anybody knows how to do this in Sketchup, it would be greatly appreciated if you could share your workflow with the Aerofly Community.

    Flattening Ground Mesh is a HUGE desire for alot of user in this SIM.

    Antoines post states that the ground poly's vertices must be painted black to appear transparent in Aerofly, which means that the 3D software you use needs to have a vertex coloring or weight painting mode. I highly doubt that the free sketchup version has this advanced feature, maybe the Payware version does. Blender is free and has many advanced features almost comparable to 3DS max but IPACS still doesn't support it with an export tool. My suggestion would be to create a tool that can read polygons from Google Earth kml files and assign an elevation to the polygon. In the freeware tool SBuilderX for FSX and P3D IIRC you could even assign an elevation to each edge of a Flatten polygon to create a sloped mesh. The next priority should be the possibility to create an exclude polygon that removes every default object in a given area so you can put your own objects on it. I'm tired of putting hours of work into a small scenery only to see default trees sticking out of the roof of my buildings and the only way to amend this is to delete a vegetation file with 100 sqkm worth of trees and completely rebuild the vegetation from scratch. It's a shame that the simulator with the most modern, best performing engine doesn't provide tools to do the most basic things in scenery development, tools which FSX had 13 years ago. Maybe the top freeware developers here on this forum could start a petition to IPACS to focus on providing these tools so that more people can create content for this platform, and I'm convinced that more content will spark more user interest in Aerofly and help improve sales. IMHO this should get priority over the next ten pages of the A320 FMC. ORBX effectively canceling their development of True Earth GB South for Aerofly should ring the alarm bells at IPACS. For me it's the beginning of the demise of a great platform and if they don't do something about it soon it won't go well.


    End of rant!

  • I'm tired of putting hours of work into a small scenery only to see default trees sticking out of the roof of my buildings and the only way to amend this is to delete a vegetation file with 100 sqkm worth of trees and completely rebuild the vegetation from scratch.

    Hi,

    My experience is also that with Sketchup it is not possible to create an airport ground or to flatten a ground. So I just add a pedestal under my objects and I'm content to make a simple correction of level to ground in the *.tsc-file, so that my objects are not flying anymore (it doesn't works with cultivation yet).

    Regarding the trees from the default vegetation, however, it is already possible in a simple way to exclude a small area without having to identify and delete the entire file and make the whole area new (it doesn't works with OSM-based cultivation-trees and objects like buildings). If you are interested I can show
    you how to do it.

    Otherwise, I would also like from IPACS to be able to implement a flat ground in a simple way and to define an absolute and not only relative mesh for airport-creation. Working a lot on mountain-sceneries it also would be great if a "level to ground"-correction works for cultivation-objects.


    Cheers,

    Christophe

  • Regarding the trees from the default vegetation, however, it is already possible in a simple way to exclude a small area without having to identify and delete the entire file and make the whole area new (it doesn't works with OSM-based cultivation-trees and objects like buildings). If you are interested I can show you how to do it.

    Yes please, by all means! I just need to remove three or four trees within the San Francisco area.

  • Well, I nether tried out with such a small exclusion, but it also should work.


    Here it is:

    Add in the cultivation section the name of the *.toc-file with the exclusion-data (and optional the file-name containing the new cultivation of trees):

    <[list_tmsimulator_scenery_cultivation][cultivation_files][]

    <[tmsimulator_scenery_cultivation][element][0]

    <[string8][filename][Savoleyres_treesExcl]>

    <[string8][building_textures_folder][]>

    <[bool][auto_height][true]>

    >

    <[tmsimulator_scenery_cultivation][element][0]

    <[string8][filename][Savoleyres_treesDef]>

    <[string8][building_textures_folder][]>

    <[bool][auto_height][true]>

    >


    The file "Savoleyres_treesExcl.toc" contains for this example the coordinates of exclusion of the default-vegetation and has the following content:


    <[file][][]

    <[cultivation][][]

    <[string8][coordinate_system][lonlat]>

    <[vegetation_exclusion_zone_list][vegetation_map_exclusion_zone_list][]

    <[vegetation_map_exclusion_zone][element][0]

    <[vector2_float64][min][7.2000 46.1000]>

    <[vector2_float64][max][7.2500 46.1500]>

    >

    >

    >

    >



    Hope it work's!

    Regards,

    Christophe

  • ...
    Otherwise, I would also like from IPACS to be able to implement a flat ground in a simple way and to define an absolute and not only relative mesh for airport-creation. Working a lot on mountain-sceneries it also would be great if a "level to ground"-correction works for cultivation-objects.


    Cheers,

    Christophe

    Christophe,


    just for your information:

    I use AC3D, because IPACS added an aerofly export program to it.

    We can define an absolute mesh instead of a relative mesh for the airport. I had to do this at the Grand Coulee Dam.

    The method to level the airport area was to switch off the autoheight in the TSC and set the related object to a fixed height.

    This gives us a nearly flat airport with a newly formed steep slope behind the hangars.




    You'll find the description and data in the WaN: Grand Coulee Dam

  • I also defined an absolute mesh for Courchevel, it works nicely despite it crashes aircraft with retractable undercarriage... no problem with fixed gears.


    Cheers

    Antoine

    Config : i7 6900K - 20MB currently set at 4.00GHz, Cooling Noctua NH-U14S, Motherboard ASUS Rampage V Extreme U3.1, RAM HyperX Savage Black Edition 16GB DDR4 3000 MHz, Graphic Card Gigabyte GeForce GTX 1080 8GB, Power supply Corsair RM Series 850W, Windows 10 64 bit.

  • Although it's good that you can do that with AC3D, it still requires users to buy a Payware modeling tool (though not as expensive as 3DS Max) and to have some knowledge how to use it. A simple flatten polygon should require no investment and modeling skills at all. As I said, as you can draw polygons in Google Earth (which is free) it would be great to have a way of importing those polygons into Aerofly and assign an elevation to them. This would only take a minute and then you could go on and place your objects on the flat ground.

    Also in your first screenshot, what is the floating white line at the intersection between the taxiway and the runway? Is that an elevation issue with a decal?

  • Assuming this is true about Sketchup. Not holding you to it because I know you use 3DSMax for your work.

    I've attempted this in Sketchup but was unsuccessful. This was awhile ago, and I easily just moved on to other things.

    If anybody knows how to do this in Sketchup, it would be greatly appreciated if you could share your workflow with the Aerofly Community.

    Flattening Ground Mesh is a HUGE desire for alot of user in this SIM.

    Not sure what you guys are talking about, but if I understand I can try to help, I know sketchup.


    Antoines post states that the ground poly's vertices must be painted black to appear transparent in Aerofly, which means that the 3D software you use needs to have a vertex coloring or weight painting mode. I highly doubt that the free sketchup version has this advanced feature, maybe the Payware version does.


    End of rant!

    OK Mr Rant :) Sketchup does support edge (vertex) material and coloring, on all versions since the beginning. If by "weight painting" you mean thickness of lines, it's not great but it can be done too.

    So that at least won't be an issue. now is the "black" in sketchup identified as black for aerofly, not sure, seems to work on buildings.


    Hi,

    My experience is also that with Sketchup it is not possible to create an airport ground or to flatten a ground.

    Cheers,

    Christophe

    "create an airport ground", I don't know. "flatten a ground" I'm not sure what you mean. Can I flatten things in sketchup, yes for sure, I can flatten all kind of things, all kind of ways, from vertical projection to unfolding. But I'm not sure in this case what we would be starting from.

  • OK Mr Rant :) Sketchup does support edge (vertex) material and coloring, on all versions since the beginning. If by "weight painting" you mean thickness of lines, it's not great but it can be done too.

    So that at least won't be an issue. now is the "black" in sketchup identified as black for aerofly, not sure, seems to work on buildings.

    If I'm not mistaken weight painting has nothing to do with visible colors on the model, it's a method of designating how much a certain vertex within a 3D model will be influenced by an action or modifier. I've seen videos where people used it to simulate how skin moves when muscles and bones beneath are moving, the vertices reacted differently (some followed the movement more than others like stiff or soft tissue) depending on which "weight" is assigned to them and the weight is shown by different colors in the modeling view. It's been awhile since I last used sketchup but I can't remember an option like that.

  • Guys, you're great! I would not have expected such a lively discussion.


    Unfortunately, it doesn't seem that easy to straighten a piece of inclined ground, although some of you have probably already done so.


    Since I'm only interested in the underground of this particular church, the effort to get involved in different programs and possibly to buy payware might be a bit over the top.


    Would any of the experts be willing to level the small piece of ground directly under the church for me?


    The church is located here: https://goo.gl/maps/qnk5kbiTkxUu27Nb9


    That's what it looks like on Google Maps:



    And like this currently in FS 2:


    Here you see how uneven the underground is:



    I would greatly appreciate it if any of you would do me this favor.


    Thank you very much

    Luca

  • If I'm not mistaken weight painting has nothing to do with visible colors on the model, it's a method of designating how much a certain vertex within a 3D model will be influenced by an action or modifier. I've seen videos where people used it to simulate how skin moves when muscles and bones beneath are moving, the vertices reacted differently (some followed the movement more than others like stiff or soft tissue) depending on which "weight" is assigned to them and the weight is shown by different colors in the modeling view. It's been awhile since I last used sketchup but I can't remember an option like that.

    I see, so yes you're right, I don't know of anything like that in Sketchup, so no "weight painting". That said, sketchup is highly customizable through addons in Ruby, so knowing what is required, it probably would be possible (I don't know how difficult) to get there.

  • I cannot do what you ask, but here is one easy solution:

    Get the 3D model you're using (fix it, BTW), extend it by modeling the ground around the church also all the way to where it blends with the hill. Then drop that model on top of the mountain, everything that is modeled flat will then be flat. Better and easier solution than "flattening" the existing ground.

    Again I cannot do as I cannot convert, nor do I have the model to start with anyway.


    See example below. That was then dropped onto the scenery, height adjusted (Apollo 50), and the edges blend nicely as the model edges "disappear" below the actual ortho ground.


  • Here is a crude model, and based on old version of it, so it would need work:

    https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.c…di-San-Luca-verso-il-1755


    Here is a greater model, that probably would work perfect. It may need a bit of ground work, but nothing extensive:

    https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.c…525f9/Madonna-di-San-Luca

    It even has the water tower which is not present on the FS2 ortho ground, but there on google.


    Nothing to buy. Get sketchup, import model, fix it, make sure you apply texture on both sides of each face, use the converters and tools from the SDK (on PC) learn how to position in FS2 (I don't know how to but lots of people do) and done.

  • Hi ussovia, I like your idea!


    The model looks nice. I registrated and opened SketchUp (the browser version) and managed to insert the church.

    fix it,

    What should be fixed?


    make sure you apply texture on both sides of each face

    How can I do this?


    In which format must I export (free version) to be able to open it in ModelConverterX?


    Thank you for support!


    Cheers

    Luca

  • Hi Luca,

    Please find the converted model from the 3D Warehouse by dbortola, https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.c…525f9/Madonna-di-San-Luca attached. I flipped some inverted faces.

    It was converted by ModelConverterX and its elevation lowered by -6m in the TSC.

    It blends fine on a 20m elevation mesh.

    Tell me, if you need that mesh (only Bologna area).