Might it be considered in the future that Navigraph data could be synced with the sim for those with subscriptions? Or that the sim itself could start off with a particular Navigraph set and on the occasion be updated?
Navigation Database AIRAC Cycle, Navigraph
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Asheroo -
July 5, 2018 at 3:15 PM -
Thread is Resolved
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People still complain if they select a localiser only approach, see Buchanan 19R on your map.
What happened to the real world localiser approach to Buchanan in FS2? I used to enjoy it in mobile, it is offset from the runway direction. It vanished for some reason and these suspicious alternative runway ILSs appeared in both PC and mobile, they never showed up in SkyVector and are not in Thomas' map.
....Later.... The 19R localiser can be dialed in manually, I had a very pleasant run in both the 320 (using its CDU page for the first time 😀) and in the 737 using the lovely manual dial ADF. The navigation page for Buchanan still looks very odd.
Thanks for the manual nav control Airbus, I will start to use it a lot more now.
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- Official Post
Might it be considered in the future that Navigraph data could be synced with the sim for those with subscriptions? Or that the sim itself could start off with a particular Navigraph set and on the occasion be updated?
We are using some real world database which should be equivalent to what navigraph is providing, just not updated as much, still contains a lot of information. Considering that very few users from our user base will have such a subscription it would just be a waste of programming time.
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Will Aerofly FS2 ever get a navdata update? The fixes in this game are out of date and it makes it hard to plan flights with other tools such as SkyVector or SimBrief.
Dylan
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- Official Post
Currently the price for an up to date aviation navigation database is unreasonably high so unfortunately this has to wait a bit.
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Or allow Navigraph integration? No cost to you, then - apart from dev cost.
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- Official Post
We want to offer a solution that works for all of our customers and only a small minority of users know what Navigraph is. We need one consistent navigation database across all of our platforms to allow new features like new approach procedures or shareable user-defined routes to work on all of our platforms.
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We want to offer a solution that works for all of our customers and only a small minority of users know what Navigraph is. We need one consistent navigation database across all of our platforms to allow new features like new approach procedures or shareable user-defined routes to work on all of our platforms.
I’d beg to differ regarding “a small minority” - Navigraph is pretty much the de facto for the sim world. Why re-invent the wheel?
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Navigraph is pretty much the de facto for the sim world
I think Jet Pack means only a small minority of the flight sim world knows what Navigraph is. Of all the buyers of (for instance) FSX maybe 5% know what Navigraph is. The people who participate on forums like AVSIM simply are a small minority of the people who own a flight sim. In the dedicated die hard sim world Navigraph is indeed the de facto but that doesn't change the fact that most virtual pilots have no idea what it is.
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I guess the opposite is the case, most of the people know that for updating their navdata, they have either navigraph or navdata pro
I assume that Jetpack meant that only a small minority of the aerofly flightsim world know what navigraph is ...
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I think flamingpie had it right the first time.
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I think Jet Pack means only a small minority of the flight sim world knows what Navigraph is. Of all the buyers of (for instance) FSX maybe 5% know what Navigraph is. The people who participate on forums like AVSIM simply are a small minority of the people who own a flight sim. In the dedicated die hard sim world Navigraph is indeed the de facto but that doesn't change the fact that most virtual pilots have no idea what it is.
Yep, totally agree. But for those that care about Nav data (which is what the OP seems to want, as do quite a few of us), Navigraph is at least one of the obvious choices. Those simmers that aren’t really all that concerned with Nav Data and just enjoy the flying won’t care whatever solution is implemented. So, why not just implement a well known system for those of us that do care enough?
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- Official Post
It's not as easy as snapping your fingers, it takes quite some time to implement a connection to the outside in a way that works reliable and fast and it still creates a discrepancy between the average user and someone that has a Navigraph subscription and this could make some upcoming features unavailable for either user group. Instead of adding support for the few customers that actively use Navigraph we would prefer to offer a solution that works for everyone.
I already have a lot of questions that would pop up if we start implementing such a system:
"Will this work with either database?", "Now we have to test everything twice, once per database", "Now we have to check that everything still works after each navigation database update", "How do we save the user credentials securely so that they don't have to sign in all the time", "Do we have secure internet access protocols?", "How can we convert the navigraph database into a format that we can load quickly", "Are we even allowed to do that?", "Are we allowed to save their database locally for eternity or do we also have to check if the user is still signed in and still has a valid subscription every time aerofly is started". "What happens when there is no internet connection to check that", "How do we prevent users from copying the database from one pc to the other", "Does that work on Mac?", "Does it work on mobile?", "How big is the file size for the database, is that too big for a mobile app?", "Are they ever going to change their navigation database format and how often does it happen". "What happens to my saved flight plans or flights when I switch the database source (if that is added)", "How can I share a flight-plan to a user that doesn't have a navigraph subscription (if that feature gets added)", "What happens if two people share a cockpit (if that is added) when one of them doesn't have the navigation database, is one of them seeing a different route when flying or what?", "Would it be allowed to send that other user parts of the navigraph database to allow a synchronized flight?", "When flying on multiplayer (if this is added) and also AI traffic on (if this is added) which route is AI traffic going to pick? Will the traffic still be in sync for all machines?"...
If there is only one active navigation database for everyone there are fewer conflicts like that.
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Duh? No, no , no maybe, no, no, yes, no, sometimes, don’t know, no, no, yes, no, no.
I will have to get back with you on the others.
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It's not as easy as snapping your fingers, it takes quite some time to implement a connection to the outside in a way that works reliable and fast and it still creates a discrepancy between the average user and someone that has a Navigraph subscription and this could make some upcoming features unavailable for either user group. Instead of adding support for the few customers that actively use Navigraph we would prefer to offer a solution that works for everyone.
I already have a lot of questions that would pop up if we start implementing such a system:
"Will this work with either database?", "Now we have to test everything twice, once per database", "Now we have to check that everything still works after each navigation database update", "How do we save the user credentials securely so that they don't have to sign in all the time", "Do we have secure internet access protocols?", "How can we convert the navigraph database into a format that we can load quickly", "Are we even allowed to do that?", "Are we allowed to save their database locally for eternity or do we also have to check if the user is still signed in and still has a valid subscription every time aerofly is started". "What happens when there is no internet connection to check that", "How do we prevent users from copying the database from one pc to the other", "Does that work on Mac?", "Does it work on mobile?", "How big is the file size for the database, is that too big for a mobile app?", "Are they ever going to change their navigation database format and how often does it happen". "What happens to my saved flight plans or flights when I switch the database source (if that is added)", "How can I share a flight-plan to a user that doesn't have a navigraph subscription (if that feature gets added)", "What happens if two people share a cockpit (if that is added) when one of them doesn't have the navigation database, is one of them seeing a different route when flying or what?", "Would it be allowed to send that other user parts of the navigraph database to allow a synchronized flight?", "When flying on multiplayer (if this is added) and also AI traffic on (if this is added) which route is AI traffic going to pick? Will the traffic still be in sync for all machines?"...
If there is only one active navigation database for everyone there are fewer conflicts like that.
The X-Plane implementation seems pretty spot-on, e.g. “Here’s an old but workable set of Navigraph Nav Data. If you’re happy with that, cool and enjoy your flying. If you want something more current, you can subscribe to Navigraph”.
You don’t have to store credentials or anything like that - I’m almost certain Navigraph would be happy to auto-insert their data into your sim as they do with every other sim/add-on that supports it. The more the merrier for them.
From your comments above, I’d say you’re over-thinking this - a workable solution already exists for you. -
Hi.
Is there any chance to see A320 Navigraph implementation in the future? I think it has been asked before, but many people owns this subscription, that otherwise is compatible with the rest of flight simulators.
Regards.
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Why Aerofly has no update from Navigraph like other flight sim? I will be more useful and in this way could be imported routes from SimBrief also. All the flight sim use Navigraph, FSX does. Why Aerofly live in their own world? The sim must be IMO an open world, and not a box. Guess this what does a flight sim to be popular.
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- Official Post
Aerofly needs to run on all kinds of platforms and entirely offline and the default navigation database should not cost money for the user in form of a monthly subscription. Unfortunately this is quite a niche feature for only a small group of power users which is why this is not implemented yet. We aim to make the default product as good as possible without external dependencies and this feature would not benefit 99% of customers. Features like these also require constant maintenance on our side to keep it working which takes away development time elsewhere.
As far as I know FSX doesn't have that as default feature either, I think that comes with mods. But I could be wrong.
In my personal opinion this feature alone is not going to affect popularity. -
Well plugin or not, I mean even X Plane 11 has a plugin installed for Navigraph chart, but the question is : How real do you wanna make a simulator if it isn t real, or as much close to reality? There are a lot a simmers that prefer to spend time to program a route, as closer to reality (that s why is a simulator for), and not only to sit 3 to 10 hours in front af monitor pc looking at the cockpit. The beautiful stay in details . But... repeat : this is only my opinion. And belive me, it will affect in time the popularity, because more a project is open source, more are interested in. That s why FSX was so popular, that s why MSFS and X- plane is so popular. The only reason I buy Aerofly FS 4 was for the Airbus 320 from Aerosoft. And that s why are on the market flight simulators, and there are also flight games. Now I don t say that Aerofly is in the second category, but somewere in the middle right now.
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- Official Post
Ok, you're saying neither FSX nor X-Plane support that feature by default but we should?
Aerosoft didn't make the A320 for Aerofly FS 4, we purchased the model many years ago and our designers spent dozens if not hundreds of hours to improve the model to our standards. And then thousands of hours of my colleges and me have been spent to add all the features that you see today. Everything that moves or has any function was done by us, all the systems coding, the physics, the animations, the sounds all done by IPACS and not by Aerosoft.
