Flight of Pitts and Extra (of FS-2), in acrobatics.

  • As I said in this forum, I have for 3 years the sim. FS-1 and with my hardware, these two aircrafts mentioned, works perfectly, especially doing acrobatics. However, these same two aircraft, and precisely in FS2, are the worst run of all existing aircraft in this sim. They fly reasonably well, but the acrobatic maneuvers run them downright badly: they do not make the turns regularly and evenly, but they jump.
    I ask the forum: is it because of my hardware, or is it that these planes are not sufficiently purified in this type of maneuvers?


    In your opinion, in FS2 and precisely these two planes doing acrobatics, do they behave with regularity, uniformity and precision, as do the sim. FS1?


    In other words, and to you who know both simulators well. As well as the flight of the mentioned aircraft: in FS2 and precisely these two planes doing acrobatics, do they behave with regularity, uniformity and precision, as do the sim. FS1?


    These are the basic features of my PC
    Processor AMD Phenom II X4 965- 3.4 Ghz.
    Motherboard Asus M5-A78LM-LX
    Memory Ram Kingston 8Gb. DDR3
    Seagate 1 TB Hard Drive
    Graphics ATi Radeon 7750 with 2Gb.

    Regarads: Delfin

  • Hi Delfin,


    What do you mean by "they jump"?
    What is your framerate when flying Aerofly FS 2?


    Our real world Extra pilot is quite happy with the flight physics of the Aerofly FS 2,
    here is a little performance of his (no "jumps" visible to me)


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    Regards,
    Jan

  • Hello Jan,


    What mean jump?


    If I could convert the replay function into video, you would see it very easy. Thus, it will be harder for me to express it. Let's see:


    Imagine the plane seen from the back, when I start a "barrel" rotation (rotation on the longitudinal axis), the plane has to rotate on that axis with uniform velocity, and all the points of the airplane describe concentric circumferences in the longitudinal axis. However, this plane is not like this. I start the barrel with the plane horizontally, an instant later, the airplane turned 90 degrees, but does not continue on its longitudinal axis, but it has its nose very shifted to the right and its tail very left (its own axis, is very Crossed with the axis on which it moves). A moment later, again its axis does not match the longitudinal axis, but it continues to cross (now, nose down and its tail up, and so on).


    The other strange movement is that in its rotation it is not uniform, that is to say, in equal times it does not have equal angular velocities (rotates with non-uniform rotating movement.)


    Your video (and many others on the same plane), I had already seen them on the Internet before buying FS-2. Apparently, in the video, the acrobatic movements are correct and run evenly, but on my PC, it is not.


    In any case, do not worry about this publication; There is a possibility that the malfunction of these two aircraft could be due to my hardware. That might be the explanation, and this would be, above all, a "scientific curiosity" on my part. Well, even if I can not do acrobatics with this FS-2, I have the FS-1 which is ... wonderful!


    Thank you very much for your efforts, always clarifying things and solving all problems.
    Kind regards: Delfin

  • I forgot the answer to your question:


    What is your framerate when flying Aerofly FS 2?


    Normally, I have it in "vsync on" and graphy quality: ultra.


    However after receiving your answer, I tried with all the possible combinations and did not change anything, it presents the same irregularity in the acrobatic movements.


    Again, regards: Delfin

  • Stay with Ultra.


    Turn off shadows.


    Turn off Cumulus clouds.


    What is your Framerate?

    Devons rig

    Intel Core i7 8700K @ 5.0GHz / 32.0GB G.SKILL TridentZ Series Dual-Channel Ram / ZOTAC GAMING GeForce® RTX 2080 Ti Triple Fan / Sound Blaster Z / Oculus Rift VR Headset / Klipsch® Promedia 2.1 Computer Speakers / ASUS ROG SWIFT PG279Q ‑ 27" IPS LED Monitor ‑ QHD / 2x Samsung SSD 850 EVO 500GB / Windows 10 Pro 64-bit /Gigabyte Z370 AORUS Gaming 5 Motherboard

  • Hi Delfin,


    What you describe could read like induced yaw, but it's difficult to make a statement without seeing.


    FRAPS is a very useful utility (search for FRAPS in Google, you can download it for free). Among others it allows to display FPS, save snapshots and take video shootings of any game.


    The free (unregistred) version of FRAPS is limited to 30 seconds video per shooting, but that's well enough to show your effect.


    Cheers
    Antoine

    Config : i7 6900K - 20MB currently set at 3.20GHz, Cooling Noctua NH-U14S, Motherboard ASUS Rampage V Extreme U3.1, RAM HyperX Savage Black Edition 16GB DDR4 3000 MHz, Graphic Card Gigabyte GeForce GTX 1080 8GB, Power supply Corsair RM Series 850W, Windows 10 64 bit.

  • [video]aerfly_fs_2 2017-3-27 17-12-05-89[/media][video]aerofly_fs_2 2017-03-27 16-48-57-20[/media]


    Conditions in clouds and visibility are this:
    Visibility are= high
    The shadows are= low
    cumulus cloud density= low
    cumulus cloud hight= low
    Cirrus cloud density= low
    Cirrus cloud hight= low
    The Framerate ?; I have tried with all the values and no difference is appreciated. In general I have it in "vsync on", and "Ultra"


    Congratulations Antoine; Your description of this "acrobatic anomaly" is better than mine (and with fewer words). Indeed, it can be considered as an "induced yaw". It occurs simultaneously while the airplane executes the barrel. Note even in the video, that after the barrel, I am not able to stabilize the Extra in straight and level flight.


    Regarding the Pitts, the biggest difficulty I encounter is surprisingly on the takeoff; You can see in the videos, that I am not able to take off, it goes to one side and when I try to correct, it turns to the opposite side in excess uncontrollable result. No matter how much power I put into it, the plane crashes inevitably. It's the biggest anomaly I find on this plane.

    Regards: Delfin

  • I downloaded FRAPS and made the videos, but now I have difficulties sending them. This is the first time I have faced this program, and the first time almost always presents difficulties. I do not know how to send the recorded files in movies to the forum. I'll keep fighting until I get it. Without the videos in the forum, the text I have sent has no value.
    My apologies for this setback.


    Regars: Delfin

  • I use Sony Vegas Studio to cut videos into a MPEG that I can upload to YouTube and share.


    Sony Vegas is a payware, I think there's a free movie making soft coming with Windows.

    Config : i7 6900K - 20MB currently set at 3.20GHz, Cooling Noctua NH-U14S, Motherboard ASUS Rampage V Extreme U3.1, RAM HyperX Savage Black Edition 16GB DDR4 3000 MHz, Graphic Card Gigabyte GeForce GTX 1080 8GB, Power supply Corsair RM Series 850W, Windows 10 64 bit.

  • Anyone know how to transfer video files recorded by FRAPS, to the forum, without uploading them previously to the Internet ?. If so, please let me know in this forum. I ask this, because I want to transfer more than one, and specifically one of 12 seconds, it takes to go up 1h.37 minutes, which is not practical. I guess there have to be procedures that are much faster and simpler.

  • Ah, so I'm guessing you are talking about jumps in the replay not in real time while flying?!? Yeah the recording feature only samples the positions couple times per second, not as often as the physics simulation. During playback the positions are linearly interpolated which can be noticable during fast maneuvers.


    I thought you were talking about the physics, replay "jumps" have nothing to do with the physics though and they are not dependant of the frame rate either.

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  • Ah, in the second video I think I know what you mean. It's the same effect as the shutter effect on cameras where the frame rate of the recording happens to synchronize with the frequency of the observed physics (in this case the fast, repetative roll).
    The monitor frame rate is limited to 60FPS but the aircraft rolls more than 1 full rotation per second...


    That is something you can't avoid, you could only blurr the image to create a similar effect that a real camera would have. But that is just the graphics representation, the graphics thread that is running synchronized with your monitor. The physics run couple hundret times per second, rigidbody couple thousand times I think. So the physics is fine and the graphics is fine, it's just the presentation on the screen at 60Hz (only 30 in the video) that causes a finite number of roll positions to be visible. On a 200Hz monitor those would be barely noticeable to the human eye but I bet if you really concentrate you could still see it.


    For the same reason you can't track moving objects on the movie screen or if you have neon lights (50 or 60Hz) and shake your hands really fast you also get finite positions of your hand because the light is pulsating and you only observe the lit up positions... (also works in front of the monitor for me)


    Regards,
    Jan

  • Hi Delfin,


    I going to try and interpret what you are getting at here. If we compare those two videos you just posted the one big difference between the first (FS2) and second (FS1) in regards to what the aircraft is doing is that during the roll you have full rudder applied as well as aileron.


    If this wasn't intentional then it would explain why the aircraft wobbles or as you say "jumps" when you roll. I've looked at the video carefuly and the rudder movement exactly matches the aileron movement so somehow the rudder is connected to your aileron input. See in the FS1 video that during your roll the rudder at the back of the aircraft doesn't move.


    Have a look at the settings in your controls and see if the rudder is somehow bound to the aileron axis or some kind of auto-rudder is turned on.


    Switching that off should allow you to roll nice and straight as in FS1 :D


    Cav

  • Yesterday I sent to the forum these two videos of the Extra plane, but for reasons that are not relevant, I could not send the text that explains the pretension of the videos. Now I do.


    Here are the two videos that test how this FS-2 Sim and FS-1 aircraft flies on my PC. The last, belongs to FS-1, and of course its agility, precision and elegance in flight, has nothing to do with the first (FS-2).


    Wrote, Jan: (in his first communication yesterday):
    "Ah, so I'm guessing you are talking about jumps in the replay not in real time while flying".


    No Jan, that filming is not a replay of the flight (via the replay function), no, it was filmed while flying.


    Scenes fuzzy in its movement of rotation (roll) explained Jan. Of that I said something, but to the being the frequency of rotation so low, yes, it is logical that the image or scene is blurred, but my observation more accented, was that the axis of the airplane in the "roll", crossed in excess, with the trajectory of displacement of the airplane. That was what surprised me a lot, sometimes proving impossible to control, causing the plane to crash against the ground, especially, flying low.


    And ... Congratulations, Cav!. You are right in your meticulous and precise observation, and that has allowed you to give an absolutely accurate and irrefutable explanation. I did acrobatics, I did not fall into that detail, probably because that condition does not occur in "real aviation", where the rudder, is not connected with the aileron, but independent, and is operated independently as needed, but in the sim, if it is connected to the ailerons, and that produces the effect we discuss here. And ... seen this condition, I wonder: is it possible to disconnect the rudder from the ailerons, in settings or wherever ?. If so, how?


    I suppose that that rigid connection between ailerons and rudder, is done to avoid that the users have to buy another device that controls the direction of the airplane producing yaw.


    If so, I understand, however considering that these two aircraft (Pitts and Extra) are acrobatic, there should be the possibility of disconnection.


    NOTE: In FS-1 the rudder is also connected to the ailerons, but when the ailerons move to the limit, the rudder also moves, but much less than in FS-2. I say this because I just tried it with the plane on the ground.


    Well, after all this debate, I have clarified this matter and although I can not perform acrobatics in this sim, I can execute it beautifully, in FS-1.


    Jan, Cav, thank you for your efforts, and I end this matter


    Regards: Delfin

  • Ok Delfin,


    I have absolutely no idea why the rudder is moving with the ailerons, as it doesn't do it in my sim and I can find nowhere in the options to turn it on or off.


    My suggestion to you is that you go to Options/Controls and then re set all controls to default by clicking the joystick with the circular arrows around it in the top right hand corner. After that go through and re assign your controls as you want and then check to see if it still does it.


    If when you move the your joystick in the controls page the rudder bar moves please re-assign the rudder to some other control or axis.


    Hope this helps.


    Jetpack, any ideas?


    Cav

  • Hi Cav,


    Dices ... :


    "I have absolutely no idea why the rudder is moving with the ailerons, as it doesn't do it in my sim ..."
    "I have absolutely no idea why the rudder is moving with the ailerons, ¡AS IT DOESN'T DO IT IN MY SIM ...!"


    Are you sure? Sure that your rudder does not move simultaneously with the ailerons?


    I did a general reset, left unassigned the rudder, and continues moving simultaneously with the ailerons, but this peculiar situation occurs:


    If you move ailerons to the left limit, you also agree the rudder, but, remaining ailerons to the left, if you simultaneously push rudder to the right, the rudder moves to the neutral position.


    The same thing happens, to the opposite side, and this is done by all planes.
    I continue with the doubt: can the rudder be disconnected from the ailerons?


    Hope someone clarifies this


    Regards; Delfin