I was on Windows 10 Version 1809 waiting for the clarity fix that came out yesterday. My update to 1903 surprised me initially by apparently wiping out all my Desktop icons and Documents folders. I couldn't get the WMR portal to start either so I decided to uninstall it. After rebooting my PC, everything (Desktop and Documents ) came back as before and the WMR Portal started installing itself and it remembered my boundaries. I then checked for updates and finally KB4507453 wanted to install. I checked out IL-2, P3D, and Aerofly FS2 which all seemed remarkably clearer ( the "0" zeroes seem really easy to read ) but the reprojection:motionvector seems somewhat an FPS killer but with reduced artifacting (maybe) - better with it off though. I will need to spend some time trying various combinations of SS (I use 180% and 1.25 in-game )and repro options as well as in-game graphics options. For an Odyssey+ user, the clarity seems remarkable ( Aerofly FS2 at Innsbruck especially seems much better ) - and it must be stunning with a Reverb. I do notice especially now the sweet spot effect of the Odyssey+ (I have the widmovr lenses instead of glasses ) so that I can aim the center of my VR vision at the FMS CDU and read it well without leaning but not unless it is in the center of my view. The scenery in the distance is also clearer which helps immersion.
Which graphics card do you have?
Sounds exciting! Will check this update out. I thought I had it installed yesterday but when manually checking it was not updated. Was on 1809 as well but that's because I had disabled auto updates. Thanks for reminder!
I have a rtx2070 on a 5ghz 9700k
Hard for me to tell just how much more clarity was gained, however this update did seem to improve the stability of WMR while in game.
Example while having motion reprojection always activated I would get horrible tearing/lag effect in menus. That is now gone. Of course it is important to also have "renderTargetScale" settings set to 2.0 rather than 1.0 otherwise there is a horrible shimmering in the distance.
Do any of you guys ever have trouble getting AF2 audio to play out of your Odyssey headsets? (Audio works from other applications except AF2) It's like it's a hit or miss sometimes.
Jake, how do you have your reprojection set in the WMR driver settings? "motionReprojectionMode" : "motionvector",
A few weeks ago I made the switch to "Motionvector" after realizing I never had MotionReprojection properly activated. I have not tried "Auto" yet but perhaps I should give it a try?
I figured having reprojection on constant 45fps, it would just make a smoother experience. (I could be wrong, and perhaps "Auto" is better)
As I mentioned earlier, by enabling "motionvector" I had a bit of lagging/glitchy/tearing menu screens. Since the Windows 1903 update, all that is fixed.
I heard some people didn't like Auto. I'm updating from Win10 1803 now so I was also behind more than I thought.
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Just for comparison sake, I measured frame rates to find what combinations of SS and RenderScaleFactor (after the 1903 update + blurriness fix) I could use with AFS2 at Orbx Monterrey with the Q400 - again I have a 5ghz 9700K and an RTX 2070 and my Odyssey+. I am sitting at the numbers with 10R and the default eye position (hit the space bar) which shows the left hand instrument panel. SS is set with SteamVR Video tab and Application tab= 100%
max for 90 fps--------------max for 60 fps (expecting to use reprojection)
Personally, I would rather operate at 90fps because reprojection seems jumpy right now. My clarity test is to read my weight on the Perf page of the CDU without leaning in. Shadows are High, Building and Tree density at medium - rest at Ultra - and I am using Vulcan, HQAA off. The improvement of clarity with the scenery is impressive as well as with the instrument panel.
Do you notice a significant clarity difference between your 200% / 1.1 versus 200% / 1.50 RSF settings? Or is the difference trivial.
I feel compelled to jump in here regarding renderTargetScale 's role in the 'WMR for Steam VR' configuration file.
Rather than paraphrase.
Dan Conti, Microsoft dev, posted in the 'WMR for Steam VR' forum:
"Short description is it ( renderTargetScale ) controls the size of the buffers we hand to SteamVR for app rendered content. If you set too small a value then the buffers will be smaller than the what the content was originally rendered at and you get downscaling. If you downscale too much, then we later have to upscale to match the resolution of the displays, and you will see blurriness and image quality issues. If it's set too high, you end up with a much larger buffer than is needed.
There is a point on SS where you'll need to increase renderTargetScale, or you will trigger a downscale. If you try 2.5 or 3.0 you should see the drop-off go away. This is assuming you aren't hitting performance issues.
In terms of tuning, what you are looking for is the point of diminishing return on upping SS. At some point any value of doing a higher quality initial render either isn't noticeable or impacts your ability to maintain framerate."
He also made the point that renderTargetScale has a maximum value of 5 and the current default value for All wmr headsets is 2.0. That's your minimum.
It would also be helpful to not use percentages for SS. I've noticed in the past (especially in the beta version of steam vr) that 100% equated to different pixel counts with different version releases. Currently Steam vr beta renders 1660x2076 per eye for my Ody+. With hardware native being 1440x1600, that is already a 115% super sample.
The slider at 200% shows me 2348x2936 per eye, a 1.63 ss ratio.
The steam vr 100% base rendering resolution is an arbitrary figure based on their expected baseline 'performance' of the headset, not the native hardware resolution.
I agree that the SS percent values are really confusing in that the final pixel values are what we really want to know - however, with the sliding scale SteamVR printouts, that doesn't include what can be set with Render Scale Factor inside of Aerofly FS2. With my early Oculus use, I was able to run the Oculus Debug Tool HUD which provided a final value of the pixel dimensions of the render buffer and other performance graphs while actually flying since it was a transparent overlay on the app. I would like it if fpsVR did that but I don't think it adds up all the factors - both Steam VR Video and Application plus the in-game scale factor.
What I was trying to show was an example of starting up several times (both the app AND SteamVR must be restarted ) and trying to find the fps breaking point for a given VR app, like Aerofly FS2, the 90fps point and maybe the 60fps point for use with reprojection. I also wanted to pick a repeatable view with an instrument panel and scenery. Then finally to pick a noticeable but difficult clarity measuring point - would be different with each aircraft - but for the Q400, it is now something on the CDU for me (without leaning in ). Obviously, it is still subjective but at least it is obvious to me that the recent KB fix has made some real improvements for the Odyssey+ . For each WMR HMD, the results will be different and with each PC CPU / GPU combination!
Ken - it's hard to really tell, but I do see a difference from 1.1 to 1.5 RSF but whether it's necessary is left up to the user.
I first want to say that my response was a result of initially interpreting your RSF as a juxtaposed abbreviation for renderTargetScale as mentioned by Jake a few responses earlier. "Render Scale Factor inside of Aerofly FS2" in your last post put us on the same page and clarified for me where you were going with your table post. I mistakenly thought we were going down the renderTargetScale bunny hole.
"I would like it if fpsVR did that but I don't think it adds up all the factors - both Steam VR Video and Application plus the in-game scale factor."
I also use fpsVR and, as you point out, really represents only about a third of the puzzle. The Microsoft 'WMR for Steam VR' plugin performs it's own scaling based on buffer size and the app rendered content that it is handed.The app in our case, FS2, gives you the ability to upscale the initial rendered output source fed to . You've got all these moving parts with slider options on both ends (SteamVR and FS2) and middleware plugin that lets you manipulate a buffer (renderTargetScale) that can, if misconfigured , 'trigger blurriness and image quality issues'. (face palm)
Wouldn't it be great if SS at both ends of the render chain could be changed in real time with a pair of sliders that you could fiddle with simultaneously as you balance visual quality vs hosing performance. It would be like turning the tuning knob and fiddling with the rabbit ears on an old analog TV. LOL
I'm guessing one day it won't require manual adjustments and it will work like an automatic transmission adapting to the graphics load based on the the scenery at the moment and upscaling the near stuff (cockpit) more than the far stuff - basically SSS = smart super-sampling
upscaling the near stuff (cockpit) more than the far stuff
Yeah, well that's why all the effort into eye tracking and foveated rendering. Concentrating the rendering power on what you are actually looking at.
I'm not so happy with the latest windows update. WMR seems worse for me now. I think I'm going to go with Valve and get the Index. The fewer layers the better I feel, so a Valve product running a SteamVR app seems a safer bet to get the best results.
The fewer layers the better I feel.
FS2 -> SteamVr -> [WMRforSteamVR] -> WMR -> your eyeballs.
I agree with you, too many moving parts.
I seem to remember it working much better in earlier iterations. I'm opted into the SVR beta and that seems to change almost daily now. It can certainly be frustrating.
I agree with your frustrations Phil. WMR can feel clunky no doubt. I really have my eyes set on the new HP Reverb Resolution quality, but I want to see other companies release their version before I jump into a new headset. I do miss having outside in positional tracking, and the new Index with controllers seems like a blast. I was just hoping they would have had a bit higher screen resolution. With that being said, looking forward to next gen Graphics Cards..
Don't forget that this newest *yesterday, July 25 ) version of SteamVR for WMR updated the default.vrsettings file so as to remove the reference to RenderTargetScale - and therefore turned off reprojection. We need to edit the file again.
I am running the SteamVR SS at 160% with reprojection=motionvector and it seems pretty clear and side-window smooth on my Odyssey+ (9700K@5Ghz + RTX2070 ). Most instrument panels don't require leaning in anymore.
I have to say that I am very impressed now with the Odyssey+ clarity. It has come a long ways from release back at Thanksgiving. I still want a working Reverb for my flight sims but the O+ blur is almost gone. This shows that the raw video content that we feed to the HMD needs to be inspected somehow - the "monitor" window doesn't cut it. Also, the fact that this video image is much clearer now points out just how important the image processing software that provides SuperSampling, antialiasing, anisotropic filtering, sharpening, FOV distortion, etc is to the final result. We were adjusting this and that and coming to the conclusion that we needed to return the HMD. I'm glad I hung in there eight months - had to do a lot on leaning in to get by.