Removing a tree from a cultivation file?

  • I have downloaded and am using one of IZ0JUB's wonderful cultivation files for my southwest UK photo scenery. However I have found an anomaly (a giant vertical tree) and would like to know if it is possible to exclude/hide/remove the object from the original file or create an additional file that would do the same?


    Thanks!

  • This is exactly what I’ve started using, but it’ll take me ages to cover the area IZ0JUB has already completed, so I’d rather use his ,TOC/.TSC files and make specific changes. But I don’t think I can edit his files to remove this rogue tree, that’s why I need an exclude/removal technique if possible.

  • The first thing to look at is, check whether IZ0JUB's TOC files are in binary or text format:

    Try opening 1 with notepad, if you get a listing of kabbalistic signs, then the file was compiled in binary format and you cannot edit it

    If it's in text format you can easily edit it, you "just" need to find the rogue tree...


    Cheers

    Antoine

    Config : i7 6900K - 20MB currently set at 4.00GHz, Cooling Noctua NH-U14S, Motherboard ASUS Rampage V Extreme U3.1, RAM HyperX Savage Black Edition 16GB DDR4 3000 MHz, Graphic Card Gigabyte GeForce GTX 1080 8GB, Power supply Corsair RM Series 850W, Windows 10 64 bit.

  • The first thing to look at is, check whether IZ0JUB's TOC files are in binary or text format:

    Try opening 1 with notepad, if you get a listing of kabbalistic signs, then the file was compiled in binary format and you cannot edit it

    If it's in text format you can easily edit it, you "just" need to find the rogue tree...

    That is in fact a good idea :) I had (wrongly) assumed that they would be compiled in binary format, however you are correct that they are text format. However, opening the file took a while and it's pretty much too slow and unwieldy to sift through as it is 1.2GB in size and scrolling through it was impossible. That aside, finding the *exact* tree would be like trying to find a needle in a haystack I think anyway. It wouldn't really bother me, except that the tree is so tall that I mistook it for a radio mast while flying around in VFR :D

  • Actually I think this whole thread is likely irrelevant now anyway.

    I went back into the sim to try and establish exactly where the anomaly was (I'd paused it at the location) and the towering oversized tree has gone! So, I'm going to assume it was some sort of visual or calculation error when rendering the cultivation :/

  • Ok, well I think things may not be quite so straightforward...

    After thinking this house of numerous floors was originally an anomaly, I think it may actually be what is being used to represent a radio antenna in the sim - was this intentional, or has the wrong object been pulled in?

    [Blocked Image: https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48631018346_f97f2620e4_h.jpg]


    Then I saw this arrangement of floating trees. I thought it might be a Vulkan rendering issue, so switched back to OpenGL and it seemed to fix the issue. However, I am also trying to run my own .TOC to add small additional details to specific areas. Can someone confirm that it is possible (or not) to run more than one .TOC file in an area as long as it named differently, or could my own .TOC be causing possible conflicts?


    [Blocked Image: https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48631164987_7fa067428e_h.jpg]


    Any further thoughts/suggestions are appreciated.


    Thanks!

  • Quote

    ...

    After thinking this house of numerous floors was originally an anomaly, I think it may actually be what is being used to represent a radio antenna in the sim - was this intentional, or has the wrong object been pulled in?

    [Blockierte Grafik: https://live.staticflickr.com/…31018346_f97f2620e4_h.jpg]

    ...

    These house-towers instead of radio masts unfortunately occur again and again. I saw on a base map that there is written "tower" at the respective positions. I have observed this effect with radio masts and chimneys so far.


    Because of other projects I have not dealt with it further so far.


    Tschüss, Michael (III)

  • These house-towers instead of radio masts unfortunately occur again and again. I saw on a base map that there is written "tower" at the respective positions. I have observed this effect with radio masts and chimneys so far.


    Because of other projects I have not dealt with it further so far.


    Tschüss, Michael (III)

    Thanks Michael for confirming this and that it is not just an error I'm seeing in the sim :thumbup:

  • Yes they are supposed to be TV/Radio Communications Towers.


    The ScenProc script is courtesy of these chaps:


    # Script amended, modified and enhanced by Rodeo

    # Script updated by Crispy136

    # Street lighting update provide by Kenventions


    Pity FS 2 object library cannot make a better looking tower?


    When the OSM Data shows a communications tower this is what ScenProc produces.


    Perhaps the experts out there can clarify this for all of us?


    Kindest Regards, Michael.

  • Perhaps the experts out there can clarify this for all of us?

    Yes, the following lines are responsible for ScenProc generated towers.

    Just coment them by a proceding "#" to suppress the generation.




    The better solution is Kens TowerProc program:

    https://flight-sim.org/filebas…hp?entry/132-towerproctl/


  • Can someone confirm that it is possible (or not) to run more than one .TOC file in an area as long as it named differently.....

    Yes, I can confirm this, it is possible. I have regions where I have separate toc files for forests, houses, pylons etc.

    Best regards,

    Thomas


    i7-6700K @ 4.0 GHz, Geforce GTX 1080, 32MB RAM, 500 GB SSD, 1 TB SSD, 1TB HD, 32" Monitor 4K, Oculus Rift

  • Thanks folks for the extra information regarding the antennas and that multiple .TOC files are possible. It would seem that the floating trees issue might well have been related to the Vulkan renderer then as they returned to proper placement after switching back to OpenGL. I'll look out for more anomalies, but at least after your help I can proceed with what I'm working on knowing that I'm not doing anything wrong.


    Cheers!

  • (...) However, opening the file took a while and it's pretty much too slow and unwieldy to sift through as it is 1.2GB in size and scrolling through it was impossible. That aside, finding the *exact* tree would be like trying to find a needle in a haystack I think anyway. It wouldn't really bother me, except that the tree is so tall that I mistook it for a radio mast while flying around in VFR :D

    Yes, but that's an important starting point : your TOC file is editable, the next question is "how to find the specific object I want to edit ?"


    To my understanding, and unless IPACS changed anything at how cultivation is loaded into memory, large 1GB+ TOC files are very suboptimal in AFS2, since they're loaded as block into the memory, causing the sim to lag and floating objects issues, I think one should never generate cultivation that way.


    Still to my understanding, one should generate mutliple small tiles of cultivation instead, that load smoothly into memory while flying around the place.


    That being said there are different approaches for identifying objects in a TOC file.


    Earlier in this thread Hartman advised you the AFS2 Cultivation/Scenery editor tool, did you try it ?


    Antoher method if you can code is writing a script that generates a KML file of all objects in a specific TOC file with their attributes, and then open this KML file in Google Earth. There you can go to the specific location where you saw a flaw in AFS2 and identify the culprit.

    Eventually, use the powerful search features of Notepad++ to go directly to the bad guy in your TOC file.

    That's the method I use, but I think the ner AFS2 Cultivation/Scenery editor tool is easier...


    Cheers

    Antoine

    Config : i7 6900K - 20MB currently set at 4.00GHz, Cooling Noctua NH-U14S, Motherboard ASUS Rampage V Extreme U3.1, RAM HyperX Savage Black Edition 16GB DDR4 3000 MHz, Graphic Card Gigabyte GeForce GTX 1080 8GB, Power supply Corsair RM Series 850W, Windows 10 64 bit.

  • Earlier in this thread Hartman advised you the AFS2 Cultivation/Scenery editor tool, did you try it ?

    That's basically what I've started using, yes. I initially downloaded IZ0JUB's cultivation files for the whole UK and removed the ones I didn't want that are outside my area. The remaining ones are still sizeable and editing/adding to them was looking like an impossible task. So I considered starting afresh by adding my own cultivation using the AFS2 Cultivation/Scenery editor, working outwards from my local airfield. But I suppose I've hit two hurdles... 1) being the large number of generic trees/buildings I'll need to place by hand to cover the region and 2) placing specific buildings/objects to better represent their real world counterparts. If I could find a way to exclude IZ0JUB's auto-generated cultivation just from the airfield would be helpful because then I can better place my own manually.


    So... I'm sticking with IZ0JUB's overall coverage of cultivation at the moment and have begun looking at placing custom objects on the airfield using AC3D. Then I will look into redoing the overall cultivation myself just for the areas I want by bulk converting OSM data (as I imagine IZ0JUB did), but creating smaller files rather than one big 1.2GB file.


    I'd also like to find a way of referencing a different source of building objects as well when placing cultivation for some that better represent those found in the UK.

  • I'd also like to find a way of referencing a different source of building objects as well when placing cultivation for some that better represent those found in the UK.

    You may use multiple sources in ScenProc actually, it's a very powerful tool.

    For large areas, I get better results by working tilewise i.e. limiting the loading area per script to some 0.5°x0.5°, or 1°x1° depending on source density, then launching the scripts as a batch to cover the country.

    First this allows setting up your script on a limited zone (much faster) until you're happy with the results.

    Then, ScenProc quickly overwhelms your RAM when working with large amount of data.

    => a batch calling in turn 20 scripts each covering a small tile is way faster to process than a single script covering the whole area.


    In order to get multiple output tiles I use a SplitGrid step in ScenProc, with 0.1°x0.1° cut, it's the best compromise I found so far for cultivation.

    I also tend to output separate sets of TOC files for buildings, vegetation and lights.

    I coded a script to automatically generate the corresponding TSC files.


    When creating a country-wide (or regional) cultivation, a good pratcice is to create exclusion polygons around airports, important landmarks, and all objects that shouldn't be featured by cultivation (f.i. oil tanks, greenhouses, etc.)

    I do this by drawing the polygons in Google Earth and exporting as a KML file.

    In ScenProc, you can load KML files and exclude all objects that are inside the said polygons.


    Excluded zones like airports may be cultivated separately in order not to have cultivation-free zones in your scenery, but at least these are specific toc files that may easily be deactivated and replaced by dedicated scenery when available.


    OSM source are participative: the great thing is, thanks to crowds of enthusiastic people, many places are covered around the World. The drawback is, object categorization is not as strict as in cadastral databases. For instance, in some places oil tanks appear to be listed as simple buildings without further attribute, thus no automatic detection step possible in Scenproc except manually defining local exclusion.


    Once you're happy with your cultivation, the next good move is to compile it in binary format, which makes it much lighter (but uneditable). Thus do not delete your sources and scripts, whenever somebody reports a bug it's easier to fix.


    Cheers and enjoy cultivating

    Antoine

    Config : i7 6900K - 20MB currently set at 4.00GHz, Cooling Noctua NH-U14S, Motherboard ASUS Rampage V Extreme U3.1, RAM HyperX Savage Black Edition 16GB DDR4 3000 MHz, Graphic Card Gigabyte GeForce GTX 1080 8GB, Power supply Corsair RM Series 850W, Windows 10 64 bit.

    Edited 2 times, last by Trespassers ().

  • This is fantastic stuff... and somewhat overwhelming :) I can see I'll need to sit down and really get my head around all this at some point.

    Definitely overwhelming and worth sitting down and getting your head around it. Arno has been developing both ScenProc and MCX for many years and added a lot of well-thought features over the time. Fortunately enough, he usually documents his stuff very professionally and manuals are real bibles.


    Cheers and good reading

    Antoine

    Config : i7 6900K - 20MB currently set at 4.00GHz, Cooling Noctua NH-U14S, Motherboard ASUS Rampage V Extreme U3.1, RAM HyperX Savage Black Edition 16GB DDR4 3000 MHz, Graphic Card Gigabyte GeForce GTX 1080 8GB, Power supply Corsair RM Series 850W, Windows 10 64 bit.

  • Definitely overwhelming and worth sitting down and getting your head around it. Arno has been developing both ScenProc and MCX for many years and added a lot of well-thought features over the time. Fortunately enough, he usually documents his stuff very professionally and manuals are real bibles.

    I remember Arno's name from my FS9/FSX days... a real pillar of the flight sim scenery development community!


    Well, so far I've managed to get started on editing my airfield .TOC by hand and adding objects from the XREF library, so progress is being made. It's a little unwieldy, but combining it with placing dummy objects using the AFS2 Scenery Editor, I'm getting results. I'll post some images once I have something worth showing.


    Thanks all again for helping me get this far :)